Rear Subframe tear!!!

[///Mental]

:owned: basically.

I have a rear subframe tear! :(

It's torn on the drivers side right next to the diff. Well I have an appointment with cars and concepts for friday the 30'th to get the problem fixed. But honestly with school starting up, and my enjoyment of doing other things I would like the car sooner than that. If anyone knows of a place or owns one, i'd greatly appreciate a phone number and who to speak with. Thanks in advance.

[JCapelo]

mines got a little rip in it to.....I plan on just welding

[prophecy]

damn suckage. where does that happen? got any photos? ive never even heard of the subframe falling apart.. i also called cars&concepts the other day, to mount my springs on the struts but they said it would be 3wks til they could get to it. short a mechanic or something. my friend took his e30 to

http://www.google.com/maps?hl=en&q=total+performance&near=Tampa,+FL&ie=UTF8&sll=37.062500,-95.677068&sspn=23.875000,57.630033&latlng=27947222,-82458611,14978519541600357010

seemed like they were a good operation from what he said..

[silver-e34]

welding alone wont help it needs ro be reinforced beebo had his welded but didnt last long till it broke again i would recomend these http://www.turnermotorsport.com/html/detail.asp?PRODUCT_ID=4111225649

[M52 POWER!]

http://img461.imageshack.us/img461/7671/subframerip17pt.jpg

http://img461.imageshack.us/img461/7380/subframerip37ss.jpg

[M52 POWER!]

Early production 95 M3's didn't have the reinforcement plates that all the later M3's had!

[///Mental]

mines production date 7/95.. tell me if mine had the plates.

[JCapelo]

mines not nearly as bad as that or beebos.....mine has a little crack, i figure i weld it now it will be ok..

any one wanna buy a 93 325is in perfect condition....haha

[prophecy]

jesus ****ing christ. I got the rogue engineering RSM's thinking thats the only thing that tore the body apart. that ****s ridiculous.. were there any of these issues with the e30 or did they just get cheap for e36?

[JCapelo]

never seen it on the e30s but i guess on the e36 and the e46 its common

[TheDarkSide]

:eek: That is not Paul's right?

[M52 POWER!]

No but i'm sure he's looking at something very similar.

If it's as bad as those pics ^ it's repairable but it will NEVER be as strong as before. Drive it hard, upgrade the susp so it's stiffer and you'll rip it out again in no time. Can't replace it since it's the actual chassis unibody that has been ripped!

If it ever happened to my car I'd end up selling it as it'd be useless for what I want to do with it.....

[JonnyChimpO]

that hurts....

[LynxZ3r0]

http://www.thelargeglass.com/bmw/subframe/images/19.gif

You think you guys have it bad? Look at what *I* get to deal with. And this is from a stock 1.9l !!!

I swear, one of these days I actually will weld in my reinforcement brackets and dual earred diff mount.

[TheDarkSide]

Call me a noob, I have no idea what the hell we are looking at :rofl:

[Panzer_M]

not a problem with 318tis and I am sure Z3/Z3Ms are not aflicted with this.

e30 suspension for the win!! If it ain't broke don't fix it.

[The Weiner]

its only a problem on early e46's ie 98 99

[prophecy]

how long does it take the german to figure out the new design sucks? over 6 years :chair:

[silver-e34]

its a design flaw on all e36 and e46 up till now there has been no redesigns of parts or body to fix the problem on any e46s from the manufacturer dont ask me why it baffles me as well:dunno: . there is a couple of kits out to reinforce it from aftermarket companies but non from bmw since they havent admitted to it being a problem :bs: it is definately a problem maybe it will take a hefty lawsuit to change their minds

[Panzer_M]

what about the e90 is the weakness present there too?

[TheDarkSide]

I guess as long as it makes it past the warranty point they could care less.

[LynxZ3r0]

not a problem with 318tis and I am sure Z3/Z3Ms are not aflicted with this.

e30 suspension for the win!! If it ain't broke don't fix it.
Actually a *HUGE* problem on Z3 body cars. Our entire trunk pretty well separates from the rear end of the car and the rear diff snaps off it's mount and falls on the ground mid-drive.

Edit: As a matter of fact, we've been trying to get on the coat tails of the Z8 lawsuit against BMWNA for the horrible front suspension destruction they've been having. No luck, thus far. Most people pay about $5,000 for a after-damage fix... about $3,000 for preemptive fix.

[David A]

This thread is making me cry...

Everytime I go out to auto-x, all I can think about is coming home and finding out that my subframe has been torn to hell...:(

I am hoping I never have to deal with this...

[Panzer_M]

this makes me sad, cause i was going to get a 98 Z3M in the coming year if I can find a good Imola one.

[LynxZ3r0]

this makes me sad, cause i was going to get a 98 Z3M in the coming year if I can find a good Imola one.

If you are a competent MIG welder, you can fix it for $525. Just call up Randy Forbes and buy his laser cut kit, then pick up a used E46 diff cover from a junkyard. Voila, done.

My problem is that I dont own a MIG or TIG machine, hence, no free welding for me. :(

[///Mental]

This thread is making me cry...

Everytime I go out to auto-x, all I can think about is coming home and finding out that my subframe has been torn to hell...:(

I am hoping I never have to deal with this...

if thats the case, i'd invest in getting it welded before anything happens, and get reinforcement plates or whatever.. talk to chris (m52 power) and he'll tell you what you need.. if he's in a good mood.. :sleep:

[His ///M-inence]

This is not a problem with only early E46's.

My 2004 M3 is at the dealer for the rear subframe issue. I drive fast, but no tracking...no seriously stiff springs (H&R sports)..stock shocks...

42K miles... Thank God I caught this before my warranty is done with. Gonna buy the TMS subframe reinforcement kit.

[prophecy]

any reason you're running lower than stock springs with your stock shocks? that cant be good for any prolonged period of time..

[silver-e34]

any reason you're running lower than stock springs with your stock shocks? that cant be good for any prolonged period of time..the springs are shorter but stiffer so there is less travel so the struts or shocks dont bottom out unless you have an extreme drop like 2.5" or more you dont need shorter shocks or struts

[His ///M-inence]

any reason you're running lower than stock springs with your stock shocks? that cant be good for any prolonged period of time..

I have only had the springs for ~6K miles. Since December '05.

I have GC Coils sitting here, waiting for the car to come back from the dealersh!t.

[BavarianExpress]

:germanflag: so how much is this going to cost me . after I heard about this I got under my car to check it out no problem yet but the way I drive . It probley will happen sooner then later.

[prophecy]

i'm guessing this is more prone to happen with a stiffer suspension? like koni sports + H&R sports as opposed to my previous shockless (blownout) system that was only suspended by the springs boing boinggg all over the road

[His ///M-inence]

A stiffer suspension will definetly increase the stress on the mounting points. Thats why they sell reinforced RSM for the E36/46.

BTW... BMW is covering my subframe damage... Also have differential noise too...warranty will cover that... But, it means my car will not be ready for some time.:(
I'm gonna miss my warranty when it expires 7K miles from now :( Gonna stop driving so much because my 4th year is up summer '07. I wanna get every last second of warranty coverage.

[M52 POWER!]

The problem is on older cars (like Pauls 95 M3) the rubber bushings start to dry rot and fall apart. Once this happens the subframe has a lot more play and starts "ripping" at the mounting points on the chassis. After driving it hard for a while the metal eventually is fatigued enough that it cracks and tears.

Symptoms of bad subframe bushings are creaking and low "thuds" while changing directions and going over humps.

Next paycheck I will be putting poly subframe bushings in and hiring a mobile welder to weld the reinforcement plates on... I can't afford to pay a shop 12+ hours of labor to take apart the whole rear-end and put it back together and it's something I could do...

[TheDarkSide]

This sounds like my kind of luck!

[His ///M-inence]

I had no idea it was an issue with the E36's. It is a major problem with E46's...

[LynxZ3r0]

Swap out poly bushings ASAP. I put in the poly bushings at 7,000 miles and haven't had any problems yet. Other people saw the rear ends of their Zs torn to crap at <20k miles if they did ANY autocrossing.

Oh and I put down 120 ft/lbs more torque than the S54, even, so the poly bushings help *A LOT*

[M52 POWER!]

You mean SWAP IN? :D

[LynxZ3r0]

Swap *IN* poly bushings ASAP.

Fine. Fixed.

Nazi! ;)

[prophecy]

i remember reading poly bushings make the ride alot stiffer/harsher? any truth to that? i'd definitely like to replace with something that isnt going to rot away again like the bastard rubber but dont know how much harsher i want it to be

[LynxZ3r0]

i remember reading poly bushings make the ride alot stiffer/harsher? any truth to that? i'd definitely like to replace with something that isnt going to rot away again like the bastard rubber but dont know how much harsher i want it to be

As far as the subframe bushings go, VERY little. Not enough to be noticed. I'm running poly trailing arm bushings too, which add a little bit to the noise level of the rear end (basically EVERYTHING is a lot louder and they squeek w/ very quick elevation changes).

Properly designed poly bushings should be approximately the same harshness.